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Super Contributor
not_ally
Posts: 201
Registered: ‎08-27-2010
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Signed rejection of probate offer? Expert opinions, please ....

[ Edited ]

Hey you guys,

 

Warning: long, complicated-ish set up and questions follow:

 

I put in an offer on an unlisted probate last week.   I am dealing with the person who is allegedly the attorney for one of the two estate beneficiaries.  I say allegedly because although the guy is definitely a lawyer, he is not the one listed on the court records; he says that he is working with the official/court appointed attorney and that they just haven't filed an official substitution of counsel yet.

 

Anyway, I feel like this guy has been super shifty through the whole process.  The estate has been in probate for over two years.  According to affidavits in the case file, they have been working on selling it since the beginning, which makes no sense to me, it is in a hot area and would have been sold if so by now.  I offered what I think is a market price based on the only comp - the comp was listed in Aug. of this year.  I made an all-cash offer, no contingencies, and well over the appraised value, according to the estate inventory/appraisal.  FYI, it is a basically a tear-down, as was the other comp, which was bought by an LLC and flipped.

 

Consistent with his total failure to answer phone calls or emails, the attorney has not responded to the offer, which expired today.  So I have three questions:

 

(1) Generally if you submit an offer to a realtor/broker and request a signed rejection, they are required to provide one.  Does anyone know if this is the case if it is not listed but it is a court-overseen probate in which the real estate is required to be sold in a court-ordered hearing?

 

(2) Does this sound hinky to anyone else, or am I just being frustrated and paranoid?  It really makes no sense, I don't think the lawyers get their money - certainly the beneficiaries don't - until this place is sold.

 

(3)  This to the lawyers in the bunch - there is a status hearing in the case soon.  I was planning on attending to see if I could figure out what the hell was going on.  Is there any way I could request a chance to speak in front of the court, given that I am not a party or counsel?  Normally I would think not since I have no standing, but I figured it was worth getting some opinions here.   I am a lawyer, not sure if that would make it better or worse in terms of pissing off the court.  I figure it couldn't get much worse with the supposed estate attorney, not worried about burning bridges in that instance.

 

Andiamo, I would be especially interested in your opinion if you see this and have one.

 

Thanks in advance.

 

Super Contributor
PonziScheme
Posts: 332
Registered: ‎05-12-2009
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Re: Signed rejection of probate offer? Expert opinions, please ....

Who's the executor? The executor makes the decision to accept or decline and the court has to approve when the executor present the offer to the judge.

Super Contributor
not_ally
Posts: 201
Registered: ‎08-27-2010
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Re: Signed rejection of probate offer? Expert opinions, please ....

I don't think there is an executor, it appears that she died intestate.  That should mean that the court appointed an adminstrator, which is the equivalent in that case, though, so thanks for bringing that up.  I guess I have to go back and check, either I overlooked that filing or it isn't there.  Very frustrating. 

Super Contributor
PonziScheme
Posts: 332
Registered: ‎05-12-2009
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Re: Signed rejection of probate offer? Expert opinions, please ....

So instead of Letters of Testamentary, there's a Letter of Administration. If the Administrator of the Estate petition the court to have full authority, then court approval isn't required to sell. If the petition checked off the box for "limited authority" then the RE transaction would need court approval.

 

I have no idea what's going on here...but I'm guessing the Adminstrator of the Estate filed a notice of proposed action and the heir(s) of the estate objected. The Heirs might want their share transferred in title instead of liquidation, who knows.  The judge would then need to approve if there is an objection. 

 

I've seen some Estate drag on for 7 years to settle because the heirs can't agree. That's why we then people to have a Trust so you don't have to let the court decide.

 

 

 

Super Contributor
not_ally
Posts: 201
Registered: ‎08-27-2010
0

Re: Signed rejection of probate offer? Expert opinions, please ....

Aargh.  Ok, Thanks PS, I guess I will have to wait and watch.  Boy, I LOOVE this market!

Redfin Partner Agent
Adam-la
Posts: 1,891
Registered: ‎03-15-2011
0

Re: Signed rejection of probate offer? Expert opinions, please ....

An unlisted probate sale isn't really part of the 'standard' market and is full of challenges.   In addition to all the items mentioned above, you typically have zero contingencies allowed once you submit your offer and are waiting for court confirmation (as this one appears to need).  

 

The biggest headaches I've had this year are dealing with unprepared purchasers of probate sales.  

Super Contributor
not_ally
Posts: 201
Registered: ‎08-27-2010
0

Re: Signed rejection of probate offer? Expert opinions, please ....

[ Edited ]

I wouldn't characterize myself as unprepared, I'm a broker myself and have bought/rented/flipped/managed a bunch of places in LA as well as in other states and Mexico.  I also have a regular construction team I have worked with for about 15 years, so I have a pretty good ability to estimate costs,etc.  As well as you can at least, where you open up some of these great old places and find that they are framed with 1 x 6's.

 

I'm also a lawyer, so I do know at least a little bit about probate (not as much as Ponzi Scheme, hence my gratitude for his/her input.)  I'm not unprepared for, or scared by, lack of contingencies - my offer was all-cash, no contingencies, that was not the problem.  The issue was the trying to figure out what was going on with an *unlisted* probate, where the process appears to be much more opaque.

Gold Regular Contributor
Andiamo53
Posts: 2,084
Registered: ‎07-12-2010
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Re: Signed rejection of probate offer? Expert opinions, please ....


not_ally wrote:

(3)  This to the lawyers in the bunch - there is a status hearing in the case soon.  I was planning on attending to see if I could figure out what the hell was going on.  Is there any way I could request a chance to speak in front of the court, given that I am not a party or counsel?  Normally I would think not since I have no standing, but I figured it was worth getting some opinions here.   I am a lawyer, not sure if that would make it better or worse in terms of pissing off the court.  I figure it couldn't get much worse with the supposed estate attorney, not worried about burning bridges in that instance.

 

Andiamo, I would be especially interested in your opinion if you see this and have one.

 

Thanks in advance.

 


Ally--can't really see how you could get a chance to speak. The clerk would have to add you to the docket and I don't see how s/he could without you having filed some sort of papers with notice to all parties. On the other hand, I know nothing about probate procedures  so I suggest you call the court clerk and ask how you might get added. The worst that would happen is that the clerk would refer you to a probate and/or real estate attorney which might not be a bad idea.

 

Redfin Partner Agent
Adam-la
Posts: 1,891
Registered: ‎03-15-2011
0

Re: Signed rejection of probate offer? Expert opinions, please ....

Sounds like you are the perfect type of buyer for this property.  An experienced investor with patience.

 

Good luck and I hope the attorney's involved can figure it out.  

Super Contributor
not_ally
Posts: 201
Registered: ‎08-27-2010
0

Re: Signed rejection of probate offer? Expert opinions, please ....

Not so much with the patience, that's the problem :smileyhappy: 

 

Andiamo, thanks for your input.  After thinking about y'alls advice, I think I'll go to the hearing just to see if I can get a sense of what is going on.  After that, wait, see, and hope that this gets resolved soon.